User:The Cunctator

Good idea: test the PHP script

Bad idea: balkanize discussion.

One hopes enlightenment will come before total darkness falls.

Good idea: Have policy pages as part of Wikipedia.

Bad idea: Fear-based, military-analogy policies: "it's possible that the average newbie in this generation of contributors would be of the way-too-clueless variety, and that a significant minority would be downright malicious..." "It could be a major disaster." Save the fear-mongering for the federal government with respect to acts of terrorism, not a openly editable website. We don't need the Wikipedia equivalent of the USA PATRIOT Act. LMS needs to stop watching so much CNN. (Seriously, though, if you're in charge of a collaborative, volunteer project, and you start getting a bunker mentality, a red flag should be going up.)

Really, really bad idea, nay, a breathtakingly idiotic idea: constantly shooting yourself in the foot by constantly using inflammatory language, such as "fear-based," above, instead of trying to engage people with whom you disagree in polite, reasoned dialogue. The Wikipedia Militia notion isn't fear-based. If you think it is, you just don't get it. I'm not engaging in fear-mongering. I'm trying, in what was intended to be a lighthearted way (until you came along and spun it in a way that made me look as bad as possible), to get people turned on to the idea of doing a whole lot of work whenever the time comes to make sure that a huge crop of misguided new people do not ruin Wikipedia--as they could. Most people who arrive "get it." There is always a minority who don't, and they need teaching and dissuading from doing really damaging edits.

The above sort of comment, Cunctator, borders on libel (because not only is it false, it's outrageously false and completely insulting, and seems designed to damage my reputation). This frankly outrages me and wastes me time. I maintain that I am a very reasonable person. If you reasonably raise a point, I will reasonably respond. If you accuse me of "fear mongering" and "a bunker mentality" such that "a red flag should be going up," as you are constantly doing, then you cannot expect me to take you seriously. So stop it, already. Treat me nicely, and I will treat you nicely. --Larry_Sanger

12 November: too bad. I would have very much liked to build the entry on the plane crash. Oh well.

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Well build it! You know you're the best we have at that sort of stuff. I don't know why you are having so much trouble coping with the thought that there is a place for the encyclopedia, and a separate place for discussions "about" the encyclopedia, and anything else you want to talk about. I view it more as an exercise in neatness and tidiness, rather than an attempt to inhibit discussion. After all, when you buy Britannica, you don't get all the inter-office memos that obviously went into its creation. In my own view *everything* that is not an encyclopedia article would *not* be in the 'pedia, including all the talk entries. However this is not about restrictions, this is about distinguishing the "encyclopedia" from the "discussion about the encyclopedia".

Anyway, I'm really saddened to see you taking it this way. As someone who has also dealt with the "should I stay or should I go" issue, I do hope you reconsider, because regardless of your disputes with Larry, everyone (including LMS) sees you as a vital and passionate contributor to the project. - MMGB

I agree 100% with the above. - Seb

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Oh, I haven't stopped contributing simply because of the "meta" move, even though I basically disagree with all of your arguments; note the use of "when you buy Britannica"--Wikipedia had been built on the exact opposite philosophy of a purchasable, fixed object. Framing what LMS has done to me as "disputes with Larry" is rather misleading, as he is in the paid employ of the project and self-appointed "dictator-for-life" and I'm just someone who decided to volunteer some time and effort. He can make sweeping decisions about the Wikipedia project and censor and punish dissent; I can't. LMS has told me that he doesn't consider me a vital and passionate contributor to the project, but a troll whose input on Wikipedia policy is not welcome.

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Well, many people here do consider you a vital and passionate contributor to the project. -AxelBoldt

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I genuinely and deeply appreciate your support, but unless substantive changes are made, I will no longer contribute to the project in any significant way. You really should start using the past tense.

I'll continue to point out bugs in the PHP Script, because I respect Magnus's effort, as a contributory way of saying that blindly embracing it is foolhardy. But its nature only reflects the overall nature of Wikipedia; I can't blame the Script for that.

By the way, is anyone storing tarballs?

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I have said many times and in many ways that you've done excellent work for us. I dare not say more. I don't want to get into another exchange of characterizations. --Larry_Sanger

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Thank you. I do wish you had stuck to that. I assume you just believe that I somehow transformed from someone doing excellent work to someone doing horrible, destructive things, which would mean I must be insane, retarded, delusional, or malicious. I'm simply arguing that I'm not, and that maybe the work that you have found to be destructive would have been as beneficial to Wikipedia as my work on, e.g. 9/11. Oh well.

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• M*****s "I'm not a drop-out - maybe a kick-out ;-P" For the record, M*****s doesn't want to be listed on this Wikipedia drop-outs page.

I'm still active on wikipedia, allthough not as blatantly as in the beginning (I would be trolled by LMS); I just do what I like, within the reality as it is censored by LMS

So, I'm NOT a drop-out! I might have been one, perhaps I should have been one, but I'm not. Got it? -- Mathijs

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Quotations on the openness of society