Editing Shavian alphabet (section)

== Disagreement ==
{{No sources section|date=January 2023}}
Some disagreement has arisen among the Shavian community in regard to sound–symbol assignments, which have been the topic of frequent arguments. Primarily, this has concerned the alleged reversal of two pairs of letters.{{Citation needed|date=November 2009}}

=== Haha–Hung reversal ===
The most frequent disagreement of the letter reversals has been over the Haha–Hung pair. The most convincing evidence suggesting this reversal is in the names of the letters: the unvoiced letter Haha is deep, while the voiced Hung, which suggests a lower position, is tall. This is often assumed to be a clerical error introduced in the rushed printing of the Shavian edition of ''Androcles and the Lion''.{{Citation needed|date=August 2007}} This reversal obscures the system of tall letters as voiceless consonants and deep letters as voiced consonants.

Proponents of traditional Shavian, however, have suggested that Kingsley Read may not have intended for this system to be all-encompassing, though it seems that vertical placement alone served this purpose in an earlier version of Shavian, before the rotations were introduced. Also, Read may have intentionally reversed these letters, perhaps to emphasize that these letters represent unrelated sounds, which happen to occur in [[complementary distribution]].

Both sides of the debate have suggested other reasons, including associations with various styles of [[Latin script|Latin]] letters (namely, the {{Angle bracket|g}} in {{Angle bracket|-ing}}, often written with a bottom-loop in script) and the effect of letter-height on the coastlines of words, but whether Read considered any of these is uncertain. Since the letter representing the same sound in Read's [[Quikscript]] appears identical to "Hung", it is doubtful that Read reversed the letter twice by mistake. Either he always intended that letter shape or he thought it best to leave things as they were, especially as a corrected {{Angle bracket|ng}} in hasty or careless writing might be confused with Hung "𐑣".{{Citation needed|date=August 2007}}

=== Air–Err reversal ===
{{anchor|Other reversals}}{{More citations needed section|date=December 2024}}

Two other letters that are often alleged to have been reversed—intentionally or not—are the [[ligature (typography)|ligatures]] Air "𐑺" and Err "𐑻".<ref>{{Cite web |last=ProvincialPromenade |date=2023-10-19 |title=The two small changes that would make Shavian suitable for mass adoption |url=https://www.reddit.com/r/shavian/comments/17bnvdk/the_two_small_changes_that_would_make_shavian/?share_id=xzHEo4JcmKBswOzco-qPy&utm_content=2&utm_medium=android_app&utm_name=androidcss&utm_source=share&utm_term=1&rdt=50925 |access-date=2024-12-28 |website=r/shavian}}</ref>{{Better source needed|reason=The current source is insufficiently reliable ([[WP:NOTRS]]).|date=December 2024}} They are both made up of Roar "𐑮" and an unknown first part. Attempts to construct derivations of the ligatures suggest that the pronunciations and the shapes are reversed, and may assure a less conservative pronunciation of Air "𐑩", though this is not necessary.<ref>{{Cite web |last=Lindsey |first=Geoff |date=2012-03-08 |title=The British English vowel system |url=https://www.englishspeechservices.com/blog/british-vowels/ |access-date=2024-12-28 |website=english speech services |language=en-US}}</ref>

Though the shape of Air "𐑺" {{IPAc-en|ɛər}} suggests a derivation from Ado "𐑩" {{IPAc-en|ə}} + Ado "𐑩" {{IPAc-en|ə}} + Roar "𐑮" {{IPAc-en|ɹ}} (which would give {{IPAc-en|ɜːr}}), its name suggests a derivation either from Egg "𐑧" {{IPAc-en|ɛ}} + Ado "𐑩" {{IPAc-en|ə}} + Roar "𐑮" {{IPAc-en|ɹ}} (reflecting the conservative pronunciation {{IPA|[ɛər]}}) or from Egg "𐑧" {{IPAc-en|ɛ}} + Egg "𐑧" {{IPAc-en|ɛ}} + Roar "𐑮" {{IPAc-en|ɹ}} (reflecting the contemporary pronunciation {{IPAblink|ɛːr}}).

In contrast, the name of Err "𐑻" {{IPAc-en|ɜːr}} suggests a derivation from Ado "𐑩" {{IPAc-en|ə}} + Ado "𐑩" {{IPAc-en|ə}} + Roar "𐑮" {{IPAc-en|ɹ}} (which would suggest "𐑺"), both because the closest short approximation of the conservative pronunciation {{IPAblink|ɜː}} is {{IPAblink|ə}} and because the contemporary pronunciation is {{IPAblink|əː}}. Its shape suggests a derivation either from Egg "𐑧" {{IPAc-en|ɛ}} + Ado "𐑩" {{IPAc-en|ə}} + Roar "𐑮" {{IPAc-en|ɹ}} (reflecting the conservative pronunciation {{IPA|[ɛər]}}) or from Egg "𐑧" {{IPAc-en|ɛ}} + Egg "𐑧" {{IPAc-en|ɛ}} + Roar "𐑮" {{IPAc-en|ɹ}} (which would give {{IPAblink|ɛːr}}).

[[Ronald Kingsley Read|Read]], being a likely [[Received Pronunciation|RP]] speaker born in 1887, would almost certainly not have had the contemporary pronunciation of Air, so that is unlikely to be relevant. It is possible that he approximated Err {{IPAc-en|ɜːr}} as {{IPAblink|ɛːr}} (which would not contradict with his {{IPA|[ɛər]}} for Air) and flipped the initial stroke of Air {{IPAc-en|ɛər}} from something like "𐑸" to "𐑺" so as to avoid confusion with Are "𐑸", or that the hypothesised derivations of the ligatures are incorrect and bear no relation to pronunciation.